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It Ain't Cheating Please remember! These
are archives! The Dice Setter message board was shut down. What is
published here are just a few of the threads documenting the early days of dice
setting strategies and opinions written by the pioneers of dice influencing.
Heavy Well, there's been so much talk about this lately that I
was forced to do an article about it. Actually, it's excerpted from the Axis Power Craps
book. The article is in this months Craps Companion newsletter. Irish - feel free to copy
and paste it into my articles section here on dicesetter.com. Meanwhile - here's the the
Craps Companion piece: It Aint Cheatin by Stephen heavy Haltom, published on Thursday, December 19 2002 What is precision shooting in the game of craps? First of all, lets talk about what it is not. It is not cheating. Cheats abound at the craps table. There are rail birds who attempt to steal your chips from the rack when you are not looking. Little old ladies who accidentally pick your winnings up from the table by mistake. Crooks who try to substitute gaffed dice into the game. Past-posters who place their bets after the decision has been made. Youll even find trick-shot artists who have mastered the whip shot a difficult throw that sends both dice spinning on a vertical axis all the way down the table without tumbling over. The whip shot, by the way, is rarely used in todays casinos. Craps supervisors are trained to recognize the throw, and modern, razor-edged dice rarely maintain a vertical axis on craps tables equipped with speed bumps and rubber bumpers. Still, the occasional cheat will attempt the shot - usually accompanied by the box mans call of no roll. Even so, casino-legal precision shooting is a reality. It is not a perfect art. It is a percentage throw. It is not so much controlling the dice control as it is influencing the dice. Like the expert card counter at blackjack, the skilled precision shooter often finds he is playing a positive expectation game. How much skill does it take? He only needs to control one roll in forty-three. Can you do it? Absolutely! Lets take a look at the dice. Each die has six sides, numbered one through six. That yields a total of thirty-six possible combinations of numbers. Just about every beginning craps book contains a numbers distribution table similar to chart 1.1. Take a moment to review it. Understanding the random distribution of numbers is key to understanding the controlled roll. ~table removed~ The seven is the most powerful number on the craps layout. Careful study of the above chart reveals that the seven is the most frequently rolled number. Out of thirty-six possible combinations of the dice, there are six which add up to seven. It can roll 1-6, 2-5, 3-4, 4-3, 5-2, or 6-1. All of the true-odds calculations in craps are based on the number of ways the seven can roll when compared to any other number. For example, there are six ways to make the seven versus five ways to roll the six. The true odds are 6-5 against the six rolling before the seven. The precision shooters task is to alter those odds. How is this accomplished? One way is by rolling more naturals - sevens and elevens - on the come out roll and fewer sevens after the point has been established. Look at the table again. Lets
say you could roll one less seven in thirty-six rolls, and one more six. What effect
would that have on the games odds? You would have rolled six sixes and five
sevens. This would give you a clear advantage over the casino on the six.
Further scrutiny reveals that the axis-adjusted true odds on the eight yield a 1-1
even-money bet. But since the casino is paying you 7-6 for your place bet on the
eight, you have an advantage over the house on that number as well. Shifting the odds in
favor of the player. That, my friend, is what precision shooting is all about. BBMW FWIW, I looked in the Nevada gambling statutes. The section below is the only language that seems applicable in this situation. I think a good lawyer, prosecutor or defense, could make whatever he wanted out of this: NRS 465.070 Fraudulent acts. slazey Ok, I didn't want to have to admit this, but here it goes, I am a lawyer in MS. Please don't hold that against me. I am still a craps player. As to statutory construction and analysis, I think that most people would look to the "intent" language of this particular statute. This is helpful in that it is not a strict liability type offense i.e. running a stop sign. Nobody cares whether you intended to run a stop sign only that you did it, now pay the fine. Here, they have put an intent element into a statute that would be almost impossible to prove absent loaded dice. You have to love the wisdom of our legislators. Finally, when we walk up to a table and hold the dice with a particular grip do we intend to cheat? Certainly not!! Do we intend to manipulate the out come? Who cares they can't prove the first element of intent. There is nothing talismanic and or wrong with staying on a particular axis, some people do it naturally. In addition, who is to say that dice weren't meant to be thrown on a particular axis or in a particular rhythm. daveygene we could get into month`s of debate, however, imho , let`s do it, just don`t talk about it....daveygene Jeffrey47 I agree with both Daveygene and Slazey. sitecst40 I also agree with davey .......take our winnings and loses in stride then go to your room and roll in the money ....not in the casino ........ when im up a lil to much i play the Irish setter Dont system slazey Jeffery47 Heavy As long as the casinos hand you the dice and say "beat us if you can" every shooter is going to do his best to do just that. If, through practice and determination, I can achieve enough skill to develop a positive expectation without violating the casinos rules - e.g. playing with THEIR dice on THEIR table hitting THEIR back wall - I can't imagine them having any room to complain. Jeffrey47 Slazey: The Man In Black That's some interesting reading. However, I direct y'alls attention to this:------------------------------------- Gambling know-how; state draws fine line between skill, chance St. Louis Post-Dispatch, 29 May, 1994, p. 1A Phil Linsalata "Welcome to Missouri," Mr. Linsalata writes, "the only state in America with riverboat casinos filled to the gunwales with 'games of skill.'" In January of this year, the Missouri State Supreme Court ruled that several gambling games, including bingo and keno, are "lotteries" and hence, by the state constitution, prohibited in the riverboat casinos. The ruling states that in lotteries, "skill does not affect the probability of winning," whereas "in skill games, one person can be a better player than the others." Both poker and blackjack were deemed to "involve skill", and were thus not prohibited in the casinos. But the Court did not rule on games such as craps, roulette, and video versions of poker, blackjack, etc., all considered to have some element of skill as well as of "pure chance" in some part of the game. A constitutional amendment was required to allow these on riverboat casinos. But this all changed in April when, after such an amendment was defeated in the polls, the Missouri State Legislature redefined craps and some video games of chance so that they were allowed in the riverboat casinos when the casinos opened in May. An anti- gambling group, Citizens for Life and Liberty, have called the state's actions illegal. ------------------------------------- Sounds to me a court has ruled craps as a game of chance... raydpratt The statute apparently allows us to pull the slot
machine handle in any fashion that we like, depending entirely on our own individual
superstitions, until we do so with true knowledge that it surely changes the outcome of
the game in our favor. BBMW FWIW, I believe (I'm not sure, so if someone knows differently,
please post), that sliding and spinning are considered to be cheating under the law. If
they catch you doing this, they won't just kick you out, they'll arest you. I would guess
the section of the law I quoted above (in NV) would be applicable. That being the case, it
isn't a big jump from that to axis throwing. |
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